My Dying Bride Forum

Take from me the crown of sympathy...

Religion vs Science

Discuss books, paintings, thoughts and more.

Which, if any, do you subscribe to?

Science
34
61%
Religion
2
4%
Both in conjunction
10
18%
Neither
10
18%
 
Total votes : 56

Postby Doomrider » Sat Nov 24, 2012 5:47 pm

too_stupid2.jpg
too_stupid2.jpg (48.15 KiB) Viewed 11713 times
DoomriderUser avatar
Doom Apprentice
Doom Apprentice
 
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 5:59 pm
Location: Germany

Postby Princessvenom » Sat Nov 24, 2012 6:09 pm

^ needs a Facebook style 'Like' button to click for that one!
PrincessvenomUser avatar
Metal Acolyte
Metal Acolyte
 
Posts: 434
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011 4:14 pm
Location: London, UK

Postby The She-Wolf » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:20 pm

FrankieStrange wrote:If I said that Aaron is God, does that count as a religion? :|


Of course, it can be a private religion :lol: (taken literally). Figuratively... anyone can interpret the way they want.
The She-WolfUser avatar
Arch Melancholist
Arch Melancholist
 
Posts: 1262
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:49 am
Location: Portugal

Postby The She-Wolf » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:27 pm

muskurov wrote:
Ilona wrote:I've yet to see anyone scientifically prove that a God doesn't exist. :P

The religious believers are the one who have to prove that god exists. After all it is thier own theory. If I claim that gravity exists I would have to and will prove it to you. I wouldn't expect you to prove it doesn't.


Here a passage from Richard Dawkin's The God Delusion comes to mind: a Universe without god is very different from a Universe with god.

I considered this thought genious and it had never actually occurred to me.

Gods are born from our desire of immortality. (A very funny tale from Marco Vassi's The Erotic Comedies comes to mind LOL)
The She-WolfUser avatar
Arch Melancholist
Arch Melancholist
 
Posts: 1262
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:49 am
Location: Portugal

Postby The She-Wolf » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:41 pm

muskurov wrote:
Ilona wrote:The main point I was trying to communicate still stands, though. I don't see why the two should be mutually exclusive.



They should not be.
My opinion is that when science answers a lifelong question, which was before answered only by religion (and the answer is always "God"), then is the moment that religious people start to be offensive against science. I don't think that scientist actually care much about what others believe in. But when an experiment or research shows a hole in one's system of beliefs he/she is outraged and vicious.


Unfortunately, science is plagued with resistance to change and, normally when a scientist proposes something new, backed up with data and results, of course, he or she (and that happens even more strongly if that's a she) is ridiculed at first. But in the end the most strong hypothesis or model always stands.

There was a point in history in which myth and what would become the embryo of science were separated. Scinece and religion can never be taken in conjunction. What we have been seeing over time is religion adapting to science.
The She-WolfUser avatar
Arch Melancholist
Arch Melancholist
 
Posts: 1262
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:49 am
Location: Portugal

Postby The She-Wolf » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:51 pm

Doomrider wrote:
too_stupid2.jpg


Science makes you think and thinking takes a lot of hard work.

Religion gives you comfort... and a washed brain!

:lol:
The She-WolfUser avatar
Arch Melancholist
Arch Melancholist
 
Posts: 1262
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:49 am
Location: Portugal

Postby Ilona » Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:27 am

The She-Wolf wrote:
Doomrider wrote:
too_stupid2.jpg


Science makes you think and thinking takes a lot of hard work.

Religion gives you comfort... and a washed brain!

:lol:


I kind of see it this way. Both religion and science give you exactly what you want to take from them. What you choose to believe in and how, it's entirely up to you. Want simplicity & comfort? Follow the ten commandments and tell yourself you're going to a better place after you die. Or similarly, tell yourself that there's no higher power out there judging you. Whatever floats your boat. Want to think? Sure, advanced physics is one way to go... or you can try to make actual sense of religion (not just Christianity; any religion at all) instead of just blindly following.

Examples above are highly simplified, but I'm sure you folks get the picture. Simplicity or brainwork, you can find both in both camps, depending on how deep you want to delve.

As for the picture linked by Doomrider... Yep, clearly takes superior intellect to come up with something as witty as that. :P
IlonaUser avatar
Metal Acolyte
Metal Acolyte
 
Posts: 136
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:46 am
Location: Tampere, Finland

Postby The She-Wolf » Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:15 am

Ilona wrote:
The She-Wolf wrote:
Doomrider wrote:
too_stupid2.jpg


Science makes you think and thinking takes a lot of hard work.

Religion gives you comfort... and a washed brain!

:lol:


I kind of see it this way. Both religion and science give you exactly what you want to take from them. What you choose to believe in and how, it's entirely up to you. Want simplicity & comfort? Follow the ten commandments and tell yourself you're going to a better place after you die. Or similarly, tell yourself that there's no higher power out there judging you. Whatever floats your boat. Want to think? Sure, advanced physics is one way to go... or you can try to make actual sense of religion (not just Christianity; any religion at all) instead of just blindly following.

Examples above are highly simplified, but I'm sure you folks get the picture. Simplicity or brainwork, you can find both in both camps, depending on how deep you want to delve.

As for the picture linked by Doomrider... Yep, clearly takes superior intellect to come up with something as witty as that. :P


This probably deserved a more elaborate comment but, for simplicity and lack of time, I'll sum my thoughts up in a few lines:

As for religion, if one thinks deeply about the subject (any religion), that person will start having doubts and asking questions, which will probably shake the foundations of the religious belief system. So, religion requires a simple mind and ready acceptance.

In the case of science, you can't choose what to believe in. Many times science goes against the common sense. Science is not a belief system. Many scientific models propose explanations and facts that are hard to believe, but must be backed up by reproducible results to be accepted or taken into consideration. Isn't it hard to believe that 2m of DNA are packed into a cell nucleous that is only a few micra in diameter?
The She-WolfUser avatar
Arch Melancholist
Arch Melancholist
 
Posts: 1262
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:49 am
Location: Portugal

Postby Ilona » Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:59 am

The She-Wolf wrote:In the case of science, you can't choose what to believe in.

Nope, but you can choose what you take from it. For example you could just walk around feeling superior over religious people and throw witty punch lines at them - or you can do what you're doing right now, have an intelligent conversation on the subject. :)

As for religion, yeah, nobody can prove that their religion is right. But I think it's incredibly arrogant to say that there's no chance at all that some day there might be a way. Do we really think we know the absolute truth about what's possible and what isn't?

I think I had something else I wanted to say, too, but I lost the track of thought. I'll come back if I find it.
IlonaUser avatar
Metal Acolyte
Metal Acolyte
 
Posts: 136
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:46 am
Location: Tampere, Finland

Postby firebird » Thu Nov 29, 2012 12:47 pm

The word "believe" does never come up in science. I think science and religion are completely different, fortunately. When someone blames science for demysticating and demoralizing he or she would obviously kill and destroy without a holy script. I sometimes wonder why hethan nature folks or lost babies like mowgli are no cruel psychopaths. Should there be something else that is falsely said to depend on religious education?
firebirdUser avatar
Metal Acolyte
Metal Acolyte
 
Posts: 123
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:06 pm

Postby firebird » Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:54 pm

Ilona wrote:I've yet to see anyone scientifically prove that a God doesn't exist. :P


Watch the news, and if you still need a proove then...
Life is a mouth only death can feed
(J.H. Fabre)
firebirdUser avatar
Metal Acolyte
Metal Acolyte
 
Posts: 123
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:06 pm

Postby Lychfowel » Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:31 am

Science, because religion isn't helpful at all.
I breed in chaotic frenzy!
Image
LychfowelUser avatar
Metal Acolyte
Metal Acolyte
 
Posts: 465
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:07 pm
Location: In northern vales

Postby firebird » Tue Jan 26, 2016 9:49 pm

Well, nevertheless...is this question meant serious?!
Life is a mouth only death can feed
(J.H. Fabre)
firebirdUser avatar
Metal Acolyte
Metal Acolyte
 
Posts: 123
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2012 1:06 pm

Postby joker1961 » Tue Feb 23, 2016 3:47 pm

to me both are needed to balance the world...


fellow dark lords of the underworld...hell on earth.
joker1961User avatar
Doom Apprentice
Doom Apprentice
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2016 4:59 am
Location: dead end lonnies place

Postby Rigidhandsomepoet » Mon Oct 17, 2016 4:47 pm

Interesting discussion, but I find the question of WHY we as humans believe in one or many gods far more fascinating. I see a link to Dawkins' website has already been posted on this thread, but regarding that particular question...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iMmvu9eMrg

Nick
RigidhandsomepoetUser avatar
Doom Apprentice
Doom Apprentice
 
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed May 25, 2016 5:21 pm
Location: Midlands, UK

PreviousNext

Return to Arts, Literature and Philosophy

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests